Will Thailand Change its Visa Policies for Long Stay Expats?

M

Moderator3

SITE ADMINISTRATOR
Staff member
Will Thailand Change its Visa Policies for Long Stay Expats?

Nov 7, 2013 Posted by Editor In Asia Tagged Thai Visa Comments 0
5.png




WILL THAILAND CHANGE ITS VISA POLICIES FOR LONG STAY EXPATS? – At meebal.com we hear a lot of foreign expats berating the Thai Visa system and yet despite the clearly erroneous system of obtaining a visa and maintaining a visa expats continue to choose to live in Thailand.
For such tolerance to be demonstrate one can only assume that Thailand is an incredible place to live but from simply viewing Thailand’s expat forums, such as ThaiVisa, it would appear that Thailand is indeed an unpleasant place full of racists, bigots and xenophobes.
The question begs to be asked… ‘Why on earth do expats live in Thailand?’ As a British national I certainly feel oppressed at times through Government and European legislation but of course the choice of residence remains my own and I do have the right to peaceful protest.

For the long-term foreign expat there are a number of visas available; including a standard long-stay non-immigrant ‘O’, a retirement visa, marriage visa or a working visa.
Regardless of which is applicable each visa either requires the holder to leave the Kingdom of Thailand every 90 day or report to their local immigration office.
In addition to the 90 day requirements each of the visas also requires renewing on an annual basis – but why?
The Thai Immigration officials cite a number of reasons including, but not restricted to:
Ensuring foreigners are not working illegally
Ensuring foreigners do no over stay
Ensuring a record of a foreigners whereabouts
The issues appear suspicious in that it’s not so much about compliance to regulations but rather the ability to control one’s movements and activities.
The issue of foreigners taking Thai jobs has been a subject of much debate to the point of exhaustion and yet despite the clear evidence that foreign expats are not having an impact on local jobs only leads to the conspiracy that the Thais are deeply racist, bigoted and indeed xenophobic.
According to research Thailand has an unemployment rate of approximately 2%. For a country with a population of some 63 million people that is extremely low.
Could such a rate be used as a testament to the current visa system that prevents foreign nationals from taking Thai jobs?
 
PART 2.......

The argument from the expat community is a simple one in that what foreigner, in their right mind, would work 10 to 12 hours a day, 6 days a week for US$300 a month; this being the national minimum wage to which a large proportion of the Thai population are subjected to.
Most foreigners who obtain work permits do so in order to operate a business; therefore investing heavily into the Thai economy which in turn creates jobs for Thais.
Information on the number of foreign expats living in Thailand is sketchy at best; current research suggests figures between 300,000 to 400,000. One expat resident we spoke to in Phuket estimates as many as 250,000.
These are generally divided between Work Permit, Retirement and Married visas which probably take up over 95% of those foreign expats currently residing in the Kingdom.
From our research it would appear that the easiest route to living in Thailand is to obtain a Retirement Visa. The requirements are straightforward in that you have to be aged 50 or above and show either 800,000 Thai Baht in the bank (approx US$26,000) or provide a notary from your Embassy which provides evidence that you have a monthly income of 40,000 Thai Baht or more (approx US$1,300).
Talking to a number of our sources in Thailand it is clear that the process of the annual visa is not really an issue; although changes would be welcome such a provision for a 5 year visa for Work Permits, Retirement and Married Visas instead of the current annual system.
Why do the Thais insist on an annual renewal of the visa? It appears that the Thai Government wants to ensure that foreign expats do have the financial recourses in order to remain without becoming a burden on the system.
On this perception that might seem reasonable but how could a foreign expat be a drain on Thai society? After all they have no system of welfare per say so where is the drain?
The excuse appears like most other excuses … erroneous at best or simply racist, bigoted and xenophobic at worse.
Is this really how the Thais want to be perceived by a foreigner; that is as a nation of racists, bigots and xenophobes?
It makes no sense but when you look further into certain issues the situation not only gets worse it is also clearly a flagrant abuse of an individual’s human rights… we are talking about the Marriage Visa.
It is not clear what the percentage of foreign expats make up those that are married to Thai nationals. Again we tried on a number of occasions to find detailed and specific facts and yet despite the Thai Officials claiming they have strict immigration controls these figures appear unavailable.
The requirement for a foreigner to remain in Thailand using a married visa is almost identical to that of a retiree albeit the sum required in the bank account is half the amount. Therefore a foreigner married to a Thai national must show a minimum of 400,000 Thai Baht or again produce a notary from their Embassy to show earnings exceeding 40,000 Thai Baht a month.
It is widely perceived among foreign expats that few Thais would ever be able to show such a sum of money in their bank account and furthermore with the national minimum wage being most prevalent, at 9,000 Thai Baht a month, this makes the income requirement over four times that of a Thai national.
The question must be asked… ‘If the Thai Government accepts that a Thai national can live on 9,000 Thai Baht a month then why would they assume a foreign national couldn’t do the same?’
It appears the system is deeply unfair and certainly bigoted.
At this point the situation becomes even worse and clearly violates several international human rights laws of which the Government of Thailand is a signatory.
If, according to Thai Immigration Officials, a married foreigner is unable to declare funds in a Thai bank account or a notary of the required monthly income then a marriage visa will not be supplied and the foreigner will have to leave voluntarily or be deported.
Under the UN Universal Declaration of Human Rights, which again the Thai Government is a signatory, it appears they are breaking the law.
Under Article 9 it clearly states that no one shall be subjected to arbitrary arrest, detention or exile.
This could be interpreted so that any married person being deported due to the lack of funds is arbitrary exiled.
Article 16, Section 3 states that the family is the natural and fundamental group unit of a society and is entitled to protection by society and state.
The article can only be interpreted that a family unit is sacred and therefore must be protected under law; surely the current visa system clearly violates the UN Universal Declaration of Human Rights by insisting on A) a foreign must produce financial evidence to remain with their spouse and; B) requiring a person to leave or to be deported is in direction violation to a person’s right to family life.
The law cannot be construed or manipulated in order to satisfy xenophobia, bigotry and racism and even the requirement to report your whereabouts to immigration officials every 90 days is clearly questionable under Article 13 Section 1 which states – Everyone has the right to freedom of movement and residence within the borders.
Considering the law it is clear that foreigners are not given free movement for they are required to report their whereabouts every 90 days.
From reading a number of articles and sections of the UN Universal Declaration of Human Rights it certainly appears that Thailand is openly breaking a number of international laws and therefore must be challenged.
Under normal circumstances a society only tolerates so much Government interference until protest finally plays its part.
We often see the Thais demonstrating, blocking roads and in certain cases turn to violence in order to effect change; this was prevalent during the 2010 Bangkok riots.
There is, and can never be, justification for violence; such an act clearly demonstrates one thing and one thing only – barbaric mob rule; in which democracy can never survive in such an environment.
However demonstrations that are peaceful can also cause disruption to a system without physical harm and therefore two questions need to be asked:
Why hasn’t anyone, we couldn’t find a single case, challenged the Thai Government in open court over the deportation of a married foreign national when funds are not available?
Surely, considering international human rights laws a foreigner marrying a Thai national should be given the provision of permanent residency?
With all comments we have read where foreigners continue to show animosity on this subject it is clear that either people leave en-mass or maybe it is time for the expat community to form a single organisation and undertake peaceful process.
We were recently told that expats make up a good amount of business within Thailand and if these businesses were to close down, even for a short time in process, this could effectively be a catalyst for positive change – after all putting thousands of Thais out of work surely would send message that is crystal clear.
There is nothing illegal about peaceful protest and it is your right to do so under international law – either that or protest en-mass to your Ambassadors in order to bring about change.
One thing is clear – those that do nothing rather than simply berate and moan about a system privately or within small groups achieves nothing other than allowing those to continue violating and suppressing your legal human rights.
 
It would make so much sense to grant retirees a 5-year visa.... on an enhanced fee, of course. Less work for immigration, less hassle for everybody.

When I first came here, the 90-day rule was not in force... and nobody seemed to suffer for it. I remember talking to expat residents of 20-years standing who refused to believe it! Again, a sheer waste of manpower, particularly as there are so many ways of evading it.

Still, I suppose manpower is something Thailand is not short of. But it is short of educated manpower, and to use the few 'educated' people it has on such unnecessary tasks is sheer national lunacy.
 
I possess a Residents Permit. Had it for 22 years and avoids the need for visa runs, 90 day reporting or annual renewal.

However after all this time it is now full of stamps leaving and entering Thailand and re-entry permits (for which I have to pay twice -an additional one in my passport)

Today on advice form Kap Choeng I went to Dan Kwian to try and obtain a new book. Nothing doing, but I got to see the big lady boss. She was quite helpful and called Bangkok to find out what to do.

The upshot.....I have to go to Bangkok to obtain a new book -which for some unknown reason takes 4 days to produce - and I have to collect it in person!

Immigration clearly have no consideration for farangs in general, nor those that live out in the provinces.
 
In the dark ages, it was even possible to get Thai citizenship. I've actually met one, and he's no older than I am!
 
Prakhonchai Nick said:
I possess a Residents Permit. Had it for 22 years and avoids the need for visa runs, 90 day reporting or annual renewal.

However after all this time it is now full of stamps leaving and entering Thailand and re-entry permits (for which I have to pay twice -an additional one in my passport)

Today on advice form Kap Choeng I went to Dan Kwian to try and obtain a new book. Nothing doing, but I got to see the big lady boss. She was quite helpful and called Bangkok to find out what to do.

The upshot.....I have to go to Bangkok to obtain a new book -which for some unknown reason takes 4 days to produce - and I have to collect it in person!

Immigration clearly have no consideration for farangs in general, nor those that live out in the provinces.
Click to expand...

NEP for 4 nights !!!! Dam the bad luck..Cry3.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top