CO-CO
Rather wrinkly & occasionally cantankerous member
I posted this one on ASEAN NOW I thought it might be interesting to see SF members' opinions.
A friend was looking at getting his UK state pension increased by going back to the UK for 6 months.
His story is that he came here at 65 years of age and didn't tell the UK authorities that he had moved to Thailand. After 3 years his pension payment was stopped because a life certificate had been sent to his son's address - and the son had moved without anyone thinking to tell DWP. He said that he was in Thailand and had decided to stay permanently, so his pension was frozen at that point.
He is now 76 years old and interested in the possibility of 'thawing' his pension. Bar stool experts had told him that he could go back to the UK for 6 months, claim an increase to current levels, then return to Thailand. That is partially true but he did not realise that he could not legitimately keep the increases on his return - the payments revert to the previous frozen level.
He asked me if I thought there was a way round it.
I replied that there was; but he would have to lie about his visit to the UK and he would have to lie (by not advising DWP) about his return to Thailand.
Rather like recent posts about claiming the state pension on the basis of being UK based vs Thailand based, it becomes a moral question.
Here, let me declare my hand. I spent most of my working life in the banking industry where I think I played everything with a straight bat - and there was little/no opportunity to make a discretionary decision to play outside the rules. After that I ran my own businesses and became more street-wise, discovering the opportunities to 'play the system'. I quickly realised that the authorities give you sod all and are quick to take anything or put up obstacles to doing business. They are also not the sharpest at policing their own regulations.
I think everyone agrees that freezing UK Pensions for expats in Thailand is not fair, and (despite numerous petitions/legal cases etc) no government is going to reverse the decision. But, the door is open for those who want to take justice in their own hands. I am not for one moment encouraging any righteous person (note, I genuinely avoided 'self-righteous') to do something that they are uncomfortable with - and any natural justice in this context carries it's own risks. I am looking forward to Brit Man Too expressing how simple and (relatively) risk free it actually is....... which is true IMO.
Lie, remember the lie and repeat the lie is the mantra for my friend to maximise the thawing of his pension. In his case, after a nominal increase in tax liability, and after the anticipated 10% rise in April, he would take home an extra 100,000+ Baht per annum (and receive future annual increases). The risk is simply that of being caught out; he wasn't smart last time and many experienced posters on here know that this is not a 'benefit fraud' and therefore has minimal consequences if 'caught'.
For him, he could simply visit his son for a month. Tell DWP that, for health reasons, he is returning to the UK to live with his son. Return to Thailand. Job done. Understand the lie and live with it; be prepared for any subsequent challenge via life certificate or other.
I wonder how the members of ASEAN NOW will view this one.
(Please note - please do not fire your bullets at me; I am not recommending any illegitimate actions - I am simply highlighting how a friend of mine could 'unfreeze' his UK pension.
A friend was looking at getting his UK state pension increased by going back to the UK for 6 months.
His story is that he came here at 65 years of age and didn't tell the UK authorities that he had moved to Thailand. After 3 years his pension payment was stopped because a life certificate had been sent to his son's address - and the son had moved without anyone thinking to tell DWP. He said that he was in Thailand and had decided to stay permanently, so his pension was frozen at that point.
He is now 76 years old and interested in the possibility of 'thawing' his pension. Bar stool experts had told him that he could go back to the UK for 6 months, claim an increase to current levels, then return to Thailand. That is partially true but he did not realise that he could not legitimately keep the increases on his return - the payments revert to the previous frozen level.
He asked me if I thought there was a way round it.
I replied that there was; but he would have to lie about his visit to the UK and he would have to lie (by not advising DWP) about his return to Thailand.
Rather like recent posts about claiming the state pension on the basis of being UK based vs Thailand based, it becomes a moral question.
Here, let me declare my hand. I spent most of my working life in the banking industry where I think I played everything with a straight bat - and there was little/no opportunity to make a discretionary decision to play outside the rules. After that I ran my own businesses and became more street-wise, discovering the opportunities to 'play the system'. I quickly realised that the authorities give you sod all and are quick to take anything or put up obstacles to doing business. They are also not the sharpest at policing their own regulations.
I think everyone agrees that freezing UK Pensions for expats in Thailand is not fair, and (despite numerous petitions/legal cases etc) no government is going to reverse the decision. But, the door is open for those who want to take justice in their own hands. I am not for one moment encouraging any righteous person (note, I genuinely avoided 'self-righteous') to do something that they are uncomfortable with - and any natural justice in this context carries it's own risks. I am looking forward to Brit Man Too expressing how simple and (relatively) risk free it actually is....... which is true IMO.
Lie, remember the lie and repeat the lie is the mantra for my friend to maximise the thawing of his pension. In his case, after a nominal increase in tax liability, and after the anticipated 10% rise in April, he would take home an extra 100,000+ Baht per annum (and receive future annual increases). The risk is simply that of being caught out; he wasn't smart last time and many experienced posters on here know that this is not a 'benefit fraud' and therefore has minimal consequences if 'caught'.
For him, he could simply visit his son for a month. Tell DWP that, for health reasons, he is returning to the UK to live with his son. Return to Thailand. Job done. Understand the lie and live with it; be prepared for any subsequent challenge via life certificate or other.
I wonder how the members of ASEAN NOW will view this one.
(Please note - please do not fire your bullets at me; I am not recommending any illegitimate actions - I am simply highlighting how a friend of mine could 'unfreeze' his UK pension.
